However, he also says that, “Many people report that they are able to get knives using steels that contain vanadium such as CPM S30V sharper than they can non-Vanadium steels such as ATS-34.” I’m not sure I’ve heard anyone report that before, as the hard vanadium carbides typically make sharpening more difficult. I am relatively frequently relieved that I remembered to not bring a knife with me every time I visit an airport or a theme park with metal detectors. Maxamet is hard and tough enough to meet the demands of rolling and shaping hot steel. A similar effect was found to occur with molybdenum additions as well: You can read about the mechanism by which tungsten and molybdenum lead to increased hardness in that high tempering range in this article. The ZDP has almost no vanadium, while the Maxamet has 6%. He doesn’t list the effect of different elements (yay!) Spyderco’s twenty-fourth Mule Team installment features Carpenter® steel's Micro-Melt® Maxamet® alloy—a super-hard high-speed powdered tool steel possessing properties that transcend conventional high-speed tool steels approach those of cemented carbides, the ultra-hard materials used to machine other steels. I’m not sure why M390 has such a good reputation for toughness. To understand how I know the approximate properties of different knife steels, you have to read my articles on what controls different knife properties. 66% Score of Average of Top 5: 251; closest steel is CTS-XHP at 242 “新高性能粉末高速度工具鋼 「HAP72, 70」 の開発.” 日本金属学会会報 27, no. The poor grindability and polishability of these steels can make sharpening difficult as well. This steel was eventually called ASP2060 by Erasteel and Vanadis 60 by Uddeholm. The high cost of both purchasing these steels and producing knives out of them limits their usage to a relatively small number of knives. I did some sleuthing and found that the Knife Informer article was online first. You can see what I am talking about by looking at the toughness of Rex 76 and Rex 121 compared with other Crucible steels [23][26-33], or HAP 72 compared with other Hitachi steels [34]. Predicted CATRA values (non-experimental), Grinding, Finishing, Sharpening, Corrosion Resistance, Cost. Toughness: INFI. These steels were dubbed “Super Hard” [5] or “Ultra Hard” [14] High Speed Steels, though eventually they were generally lumped into the “Super High Speed Steel” category along with M4 and T15. A2, a steel that trades wear resistance for toughness. Larrin, 2,174,281. “High-speed steel article.” U.S. Patent 6,057,045, issued May 2, 2000. Even with it being a non-stainless steel, M390, CPM-20V, and CTS-204P still don't perform as well. That seems like enough examples of poor ratings of steel. I have rated their articles based on my own experiences, steel datasheets, and how I feel this morning. [26] https://www.crucible.com/PDFs/DataSheets2010/dsCPM%20CruWear2015.pdf, [27] http://www.crucible.com/PDFs/DataSheets2010/Data%20Sheet%204V.pdf, [28] http://www.crucible.com/PDFs/DataSheets2010/dsA2v12010.pdf, [29] http://www.crucible.com/PDFs/DataSheets2010/ds10Vv1%202010.pdf, [30] https://www.crucible.com/eselector/prodbyapp/highspeed/rexm42.html, [31] http://www.crucible.com/PDFs/DataSheets2010/ds76rev1%202010.pdf, [32] http://www.crucible.com/PDFs/DataSheets2010/dsT15v1%202010.pdf, [33] http://www.crucible.com/PDFs/DataSheets2010/dsM4v1%202010.pdf, [34] https://www.hitachi-metals.co.jp/e/products/auto/ml/pdf/hsts_b.pdf. This shows how good Maxamet is at this one particular thing. I’m not sure that has much to do with wear resistance. So while adding chromium to steel increases corrosion resistance, it also increases the size of its crystals.”. Could you give a recommendation on which steel you think would be best, between M2, M35, M42, T15? However, they provide specialized use cases for those that prefer maximum edge retention at the detriment of other properties. They can’t. electroslag, forged ring/ block,etc. Become a patron and gain access to awesome rewards including early access to articles or a Knife Steel Nerds mug! Everything is exactly as you’d expect from this model, with the addition of a maxamet blade, which has surprised me in its toughness and edge retention With 13% Tungsten, Maxamet’s chemical composition is very unusual. There are some ratings I don’t know. The exception is D2 which gets a relatively high edge retention score (higher than S30V) despite a low wear resistance rating of 4 (compared to 6 for S30V). This article was written by Matt Davidson of Knife Informer. Erroneous “OPINIONS “ on a knife steel they have In materials science and metallurgy, toughness is the ability of a material to absorb energy and plastically deform without fracturing. Nickel (Ni) Your email address will not be published. Different elements diffuse at different rates, (typically the larger the atom, the slower it diffuses). T15 appeared by 1946 as Vasco Supreme [10], and M15 appeared by 1951 as Vasco Supreme A [11]. I confirmed with Matt Davidson from Knife Informer that he did not give permission for his ratings to be used. Metallurgy and Testing of Knives and Steel. I’m not sure that has much to do with wear resistance.” Grindability was an important consideration because of the difficulty of grinding such hard steels. This is somewhat surprising because of the deleterious effect of cobalt on toughness. But the # 9 of company A was different thickness than #9 of company B !! The Manix 2 LW in Maxamet changed that, delivering the steel in a utility-driven design for less than $200. This expression of the Para 3 combines all the defining qualities of this best-in-class folding knife design with the extreme edge retention and toughness of Maxamet blade steel. Thanks to Stacy Apelt for becoming a Knife Steel Nerds Patreon supporter! I write long, detailed articles that only true nerds read. Could you provide a small table with some ‘simple’ choices, say… a recommended steel for ‘very low use, EDC to the office, open mail and slice fruit’, one for ‘general use around the house and garden, doing things with the blade, that shouldn’t be done with a blade (but the appropriate tool)’ and perhaps one for ‘backcountry, hard use, wet, beat up and put to use like a tool should be’, “I would say if it’s not broken it remains usable. The full-flat-ground blade includes a fully accessible Trademark Round Hole™ for swift, ambidextrous, one-handed opening. Toughness testing by Knife Steel Nerds used steel heat treated by Warren Krywko and myself, and machined by Alpha Knife Supply and Mike Pierce. Because the chart is small and has few steels there isn’t much to criticize. Need to have an expert chart showing the correct data. From the beginning of the Super Hard High Speed Steels, it was promised that these steels could replace cemented carbide for some machining operations [12]. However, the use of PM technology allowed an increase in vanadium content. He says that, “during forging, Cr and Mo form hard, double-carbide, bonds which help to improve hardenability, wear resistance, and corrosion resistance.” I don’t know what double carbide bonds are but I know that carbides are not a positive for corrosion resistance. I won’t nitpick much else other than he says that manganese improves wear resistance which it really doesn’t. Chipping is normally considered part of toughness rather than wear resistance. Perhaps we can make some prediction of which carbide replacement steels would have the best toughness by looking at the relative carbide contents are predicted by Thermo-Calc at 2200°F: Maxamet is predicted to have the lowest carbide content and Rex 121 the highest carbide content so those steels would be expected to have the highest and lowest toughness. The actual meaning of the toughness relates to the properties of a particular material. The Native 5 features a patterned FRN handle with two separate finger choils. On the other hand, the Maxamet has only 4.75% Chromium, while the ZDP has 20%. https://www.bladehq.com/cat–Best-Knife-Steel-Guide–3368. I wrote about this development in this article. B., and C. O. Burgess. After all, they are designed to be heat treated to at least 67 Rc. Larrin, Thanks Jul 9, 2019 #2. The European Powder Metallurgy Association, 2004. And here is an example of the process for finding the optimal carbon content, in this case M42. No, toughness has nothing to do with a blade easily warping. silicon addition give the highest hardness compared to cobalt , aluminium & nickel . He says that vanadium helps produce a fine grain structure which is true enough in small doses. Like chromium it is a driver of carbide formation but is used typically in small relative quantities. according to this study : https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/isijinternational/46/5/46_5_782/_pdf/-char/en “420HC is a somewhat less expensive American-made stainless alternative to 440C. D2 is made worldwide and cannot be called a “version of CPM S30V” particularly because it is nearly 100 years older. 420HC is not necessarily made in America and is not similar in composition to 440C, as 440C has much higher carbon and chromium. The high toughness steels 5160, 15N20, L6, and 8670 barely have any carbide at all: 5160 (1525°F) The full-flat-ground blade includes a fully accessible Trademark Round Hole for swift, ambidextrous, one-handed opening. Corrosion resistance is expected to be similar to other high speed steels. Can you tell me what the rationale is for relating sharpness (their word) to secondary hardening? REX 121 Steel: Hardness vs. Toughness. A high performance tool steel which excels at toughness and arguably holds and edge better than any other carbon steel. The discovery of high speed steel in the late 1890’s ushered in the modern era of tool steel. [6] Kinzel, A. The only edge retention value I have for any of these steels is from Maxamet. The datasheet for ZDP-189 shows that it has very low toughness [2]. 2 (1978): 114-123. I don’t have a full article comparing the toughness of different steels to each other. [19] Makovec, Heinz, Ingrid Schemmel, and Ernst Putzgruber. And most kitchen knife buyers are using waterstones to sharpen. I’m not sure where the hardness ratings came from as most of these steels can be heat treated to a wide range of hardness values. Because of the help and input from all here I have made the decision to return the S110V Manix 2 I recently ordered and exchange it for another Manix 2 LW in Maxamet. Therefore I will not analyze these ratings as I already did so. It really isn’t, as Maxamet is a high speed steel designed to be a carbide replacement for better toughness but retaining much of the hot hardness, and is not stainless. “Comprehensive wear study on powder metallurgical steels for the plastics industry, especially injection moulding machines.” In Materials science forum, vol. He defines edge retention in terms of wear resistance and hardness so that is the basis upon which I will analyze his rankings. And when cutting materials with a higher cutting speed requiring better hot hardness. There is another set of specimens I heat treated of Maxamet using 1900°F austenitizing and 500°F temper and when those are machined and tested I will update this article (hopefully). The idea of “bridging the gap” between the performance of carbide and typical high speed steel continues to be promoted like it is a new idea to at least 2004 [19][20]. I will be criticizing their descriptions of steels and steel properties as well as the ratings that they provide. The Vasco researchers found 8% Co and the particular Mo-W content they used to offer the best balance of high hardness and good toughness. Early PM high speed steels were simply taking existing compositions and producing PM versions of them, such as M2, M42, and T15. The limit of hardness obtainable from heat treating of the existing grades was about 67-68 Rc, but there was a desire for even higher hardness for cutting of difficult materials. It’s possible. Obtaining them in good sizes for knives can also be somewhat difficult since they are primarily produced for tooling rather than knives. Stainless Steel, Special Steel, Compressor Blading, Turbine Blading, Superalloy Supplier. Here is an article about how chipping of edges happens to understand the mechanisms that occur and so how we evaluate different steels based on those mechanisms. I normally want to know a little more about a person that calls himself THE pocket knife guy. SP41PGY5: C41PGY5 Native 5 Lightweight Micro-Melt Maxamet Spyderco. I think you have encountered “Fake Science”. there is a wide belief that reaching highest hardness without vanadium is impossible . The super hard high speed steels (>68 Rc or so) are interesting from the standpoint of knife enthusiasts and knifemakers, particularly since knives are so often produced in the 58-61 Rc range. “Molybdenum High-Speed Steels.” Iron Age 148, no. And defining ductility as “ability to flex or bend without fracturing” is misleading. The anonymous author starts by giving properties of steel, which are mostly fine though I would write them differently. The development of super hard and carbide replacement high speed steels came from a long history of continuous improvement in high speed steel design and production. Same old , same old ! Blade material: Maxamet (non-stainless) Blade length: 2.95” Handle material: FRN Overall length: 6.95” Lock type: lockback Op Both elements are used to increase hardness and toughness. ... Carpenter produces this powder steel. This expression of the Para 3 combines all the defining qualities of this best-in-class folding knife design with the extreme edge retention and toughness of Maxamet blade steel. Also it’s not clear how this is different than “holding an edge.” And what does he mean by “remained usable”? Steel Chart. Maxamet steel specs give a hardness range from 64rc to 71rc. It's a close tie, but Maxamet wins in the end. there is at least 2 grades didn’t have tungsten at all , why there is no even just one grade without vanadium ? Since these are all powder metallurgy steels with high alloy content they are all relatively expensive. “PM Tool Materials: New PM Steel Grade S290 Microclean-the Bridge Material between Usual PM Grades and Cemented Carbides.” In European Congress and Exhibition on Powder Metallurgy. Out of stock. So it was a good upgrade overall due to decreased cost and improved properties. If you frequently use your knife to slice up cardboard, there may not be a better steel than CPM-S110V. Another interesting and informative article, thanks for the good read. How can I criticize others’ attempts without providing my own? Proven design, amazing steel 12/09/2017 By Seth Lord Always been a satisfied user of the Para 2 lineup, and this is now my favorite. [17] Kasak, A., and E. J. Dulis. Therefore, the super hard high speed steels can offer performance closer to cemented carbide in combination with higher toughness to reduce the possibility of tool chipping or breakage. Therefore, the selection between “super hard” and “super” was whether higher hardness or higher wear resistance was desired for the cutting operation. Since Rex 76 and ASP 60 there have been several other Carbide Replacement High Speed Steels that have been developed. Even where I criticize the articles that does not necessarily mean that I think the author is clueless, or that none of the articles are worth reading, or that they don’t regularly call their mothers like good boys should. But the true calling card of INFI is its insane toughness. Those more recent carbide replacement steels combine high vanadium (5% or greater) along with high hardness (>69 Rc) for very high strength and wear resistance. At these elevated temperatures, alloying elements are able to move around in the steel, or diffuse. There was a rumor about a new Maxamet PM2 release this year. Maxamet is a high carbide volume steel, ~22%. Metallurgy and Testing of Knives and Steel. Alloy is high on Cobalt and Vanadium. 13 (1941): 33-35. ASP2060/Vanadis 60, HAP 72, Rex 86, and S290 would also be expected to be a similar range for edge retention as those steels also have 5-6.5% vanadium. I’ve added and subtracted to it over the years to try and make it a decent resource, but at the end of the day I’m just a layperson and a single data point. At least he says that he took them from those sources rather than claiming them as his own. Edge retention will be very high, outdone by only a few ultra-high carbide, high … Triple or even quadruple tempering was also found to be important for minimizing retained austenite in these high carbon grades. He begins the article by saying, “In choosing the best pocket knife you should pay particular attention to the type of steel used in the blade. His ratings appear to also be taken from an older chart from Buck Knives which has only a few steels. FK Member Posts: 427 Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2004 4:33 pm Location: CT USA. While M390 does have a higher overall value than Maxamet, the way I see it is that Maxamet has higher edge retention and wear resistance. I will be using completely objective criteria for rating the various steel rating articles, just like the authors of the steel rating articles. https://www.patreon.com/Knifesteelnerds, Click to share on Twitter (Opens in new window), Click to share on Facebook (Opens in new window). The full-flat-ground blade includes a fully accessible Trademark Round Hole for swift, ambidextrous, one-handed opening. He says that, “during forging, Cr and Mo form hard, double-carbide, bonds which help to improve hardenability, wear resistance, and corrosion resistance.” I don’t know what double carbide bonds are but I know that carbides are not a positive for corrosion resistance. The Maxamet steel in considered as a “Super Steel”, So it’s a High-end Alloy steel, with an uncommon chemical composition, but I can say that the closest one to it is the CPM S110V (even if it’s stainless steel), in exception of wear resistance; the Maxamet is a great match for the S110v in edge retention, hardness, wear-resistance and price range which is between 100-200 Usd. [13] Nehrenberg, Alvin E., Thoni V. Philip, and Steven Gary. These tests showed the expected superior toughness of Maxamet, though the difference is not much to write home about. You should add Blade HQ’s ranking: S110V gets only a “6” for corrosion resistance despite the steel being designed for high corrosion resistance. Cutting performance, toughness and edge retention are off the charts. In the old days you ordered steel sheet and wire by a number. This shows how good Maxamet is at this one particular thing. A2 is a tool steel renowned for toughness. So the ratings that are generated by those writing these articles are basing them on their own experience, the reputation of each steel, what limited information is available from the steel manufacturers, and how they feel that morning. In terms of filing dates, this included M44 steel of Braeburn Alloy Steel (1960) [12], M41 steel of Crucible Steel (1961) [13], M42 steel of Vasco Metals (1963) [14], and M43 steel (1965) [15]. I don’t really like these kinds of explanations. is vanadium-free high speed steels impossible ? I’m not a fan of how he lists the steels in groups from “ultra premium” down to “low end” which is only in terms of edge retention. This led to patents on high vanadium high speed steels in 1938 [7] and 1939 [8]. Those carbide contents are supported by micrographs I took of both of those steels, where you can see that Rex 121 has both more carbide and larger carbides than Maxamet. You can compare with micrographs of other steels in this article. I’m hoping you can help with a question related to this… I’ve seen heat treating data for RWL-34 steel which exhibits secondary hardening… the instructions suggest a “Low temperature” temper (175 or 220°C) for corrosion resistance and “High Temperature” (520°C) for “Maximum Edge Sharpness”. These steels were dubbed “super high speed steels” due to their high wear resistance. “Ultra hard high speed steel.” U.S. Patent 3,259,489, issued July 5, 1966. - … With all of these incomprehensible designations like 20CV, M390, 204P, XHP, S30V, etc. Probably. So Maxamet with a value of 222 for 68 Rc has approximately 2.2x the edge retention of 440C at 59 Rc if both have the same edge geometry and sharpening. Powder metallurgy technology further increased possibilities for Super Hard High Speed Steels. Thank you for really summing up the fact that ranking multiple steels is not as simple as “what’s the best?”. Shop By Steel Type; Maxamet; Sort by: Maxamet. This expression of the Para 3 combines all the defining qualities of this best-in-class folding knife design with the extreme edge retention and toughness of Maxamet blade steel. Enter your email address to subscribe to this blog and receive notifications of new posts by email. It checks out at 64rc, and is does very well. These predicted values would of course need to be experimentally validated. Else can repeat it as if it were fact, and on it goes. Your email address will not be published. 33% Score of Average of Top 5: 126; closest steel is 154CM at 124. He next defines the effect of different alloying elements in steel. I don’t like reducing things down to a single numerical rating when some properties are more complex. St-Etienne. I like some of the writing better in this article than the previous two. The design, ergonomics, and high performance materials make this folder a go-t An ambidextrous, tip-up wire silhouette pocket clip and screw-together handle construction make the folder user friendly with several and carry options. 43. Tool steel grades used in cutlery : A, D, O, M, T, S, L, W. See also AISI Tool Steel Grades. He starts the article with some meaningless stuff about our destiny and the iron age and promises “answers to all of your questions about the best knife steel!”, He gives some strange explanations for the microstructure of steel: “When steel is viewed at a high magnification, it becomes obvious that it has a grain structure similar to grains of sand. The steel was introduced to the knife world by one of KAI’s Uber Triples, the ZT 0888. However, the first of these carbide replacement steels, in my opinion, was ASP60 by Stora, the earliest reference to which I can find is from 1975 [21]. Looking forward to reading the updated version. I have attached it here: Bohler-Uddeholm CATRA Data. Mo and W form the same kind of carbide on tempering so you can have one or the other or a combination of the two. These include Hitachi HAP 72 in 1985 [22], Crucible Rex 121 and Rex 86 in 1997 [23], Carpenter Maxamet in 2000 [24], and Bohler S290 in 2002 [25]. Stainless steels cannot be said to be “stronger” in any kind of general way. Maxamet is a complex steel alloy with excellent edge retention and toughness (non-stainless). Steels with even higher vanadium as well as a cobalt addition for higher hardness became T15 and M15. For example, both T15 and M4 were found to have a large improvement in toughness and grindability due to the great reduction in carbide size from powder metallurgy. It really isn’t, as Maxamet is a high speed steel designed to be a carbide replacement for better toughness but retaining much of the hot hardness, and is not stainless. Maxamet is a complex steel alloy that offers unprecedented toughness and edge retention. https://www.patreon.com/Knifesteelnerds, He also says what the different elements do to a steel (oh no….) I had to read that second sentence a couple times before I figured out what he was saying but I have to disagree. M390 gets a higher score than Elmax for toughness even though Elmax is tougher. *while using a broken knife blade to lever open a tin* hmm, debatable , I Like your articles, what a novel idea using data and I’m planning to make a gyuto out of HSS, but can’t decide between the selection that’s available. Deductive reasoning, almost like SCIENCE. 1.4034 stainless steel is essentially a 420HC made in Germany but is given the highest score for toughness of “7” a full 2 points higher than 420HC, and higher than the high toughness steels 5160 and 1050. Chuck, Your email address will not be published. Become a patron and gain access to awesome rewards including early access to articles or a Knife Steel Nerds mug! [3] Gornik, Christian, and Jochen Perko. It does have grains, yes, but it does not have a sandy or grainy appearance. While it is similar in composition to 440C, it neither withstands impact as well nor, does it take and hold as fine an edge and, it is not as corrosion resistant.”. Cobalt suppresses recovery of martensite, reduces retained austenite, increases the nucleation density of tempering carbides, and slows the coarsening of those carbides. “Effects of structure on toughness and grindability of high-speed steel.” In presentation at International Colloquium on ‘High-speed steels’, pp. Yet another great article thanks Larrin! The full-flat-ground blade includes a fully accessible Trademark Round Hole™ for swift, ambidextrous, one-handed opening. For example, he says as anyone does in these kinds of articles that higher carbon means higher hardness.
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